Post by Jogo on Nov 15, 2004 1:02:38 GMT -4
Mojo said:
Guide to the Christian worldview. If I can be so bold.
Anthing I do is ok if Im not hurting anyone. This is a common world view.
The reasons Christians oppose this is because the Bible states that these behaviors do, in fact, hurt someone and often times many people.
Christians as ani-gay: Well, we are all sinners. So we are no better than others. However this behavior is forbidden by God. But since we are sinners, we should not point fingers. The difference is that gay activists are not happy just to be gay, they want gay tv shows, gay educational material, gay rights, gay this and gay that. Some Christians are gay haters, that is not the correct way. God has a proven track record of punishing whole societies that have rebelled against him. And He clearly states homosexuality and rebelion against Him. God states that the natural state of man is to sin and be in rebellion against him, so yes, its natural. And he calls us to not be like that. Now the natural reaction to that is to say, how can He punish us for being ourselves? The answer is to move away from our nature and accept Jesus as the blood sacrifice for our sins. And in honor of that sacrifice we are to speak his words, even in the face of inevitable retaliation and ridicule. Such as I am now.
Abortion: Well, the Christian view on this is that the child is alive, so any interference is murder cut and dry. Want to keep from being a single mom? Try not having sex. People will shout that down as unreasonable and impossible, but its amazing the problems that are avoided by doing it the way God recommends.
Raped and pregnant argument: I once met a woman who had been raped and had a child from it. The child was beautiful and was not to blame for the acts of the father. Thats way a Christian see this. If abortion is murder then that is that. God can make good come from it. We are to surrender to the situation and see what the Lord brings of it.
Life of crime and welfare just from being born to a single mother, thats quite a leap. Your circumstances dont dictate your future, refer to a Dr. Phill episode. I guess thats one great thing about being a Christian, there is no fear that the future wont be alright.
And on being poor: Paul said he can live rich or poor happily. Christians believe that the idea that being rich will solve your problems and make you happy is a lie and a prison of the mind. Just as television tries teach that unattractive people are worthless. God promised hard work will be rewarded, and I have seen that. When honestly in my heart I really am working hard. That doesnt mean you could be rich and it doesnt mean you wont have bad time. The difference is we believe that everything will work out fine at the end. And along the way we will be provided for, and we are. In fact, I have never met an American that starved to death. Not one.
On Bush: We do not all support him. But there is evidence he is one of us. Therefore we would rather have him than someone to whom there are no rules at all.
On the war: I actually dont think it was a good idea, but in the previous post I explained that it was necessary, as a nation. That is a law of the world. But I do not think it was wise. Because if you study the middle east wars you can see that occupation there turns into a war of attrition, which is bad. But Bush is our leader and Christians are instructed that we are to submit to them. The world teaches "questions authority and fight for what is yours" mentalities. The Lord teachs submission to leaders unless they ask you to disobey the Lord. And we are to be ready to die for that. But I think it might be easier to be fed to lions than to stand up to public ridicule. Seriously.
God says that the world is in rebelion to him and all are born that way. Also that an evil and perverse generation calls an evil thing good and a good thing evil.
Also God says that the natural man does not understand the ways of the Lord. And that the preaching is foolishness to the natural man.
This is why Christians are so diametrically opposed to pretty much all the values of world.
This is not intended as an argument, just a clarification of where we are coming from.
Mojo you are a educated person and this don't change my opinion on you but I couldn't disagree more. You couldn't be christian and make up your own mind on current subjects? You prefer to follow blindly a book that was wrote thousands of years ago? I guess there's no other way to explain it. When it comes to religion or passion there is no way to be reasonable whatever that is.
Gays: I don't like them. I would prefer that there weren't any. I have a weak stomach and I hate seeing to men kissing but I'm not proud of it. The fact is they exist and they have every right to be happy like I want to be happy. I'm not going after them just because the lord is against them. I rather just close my eyes.
Abortion: You are very right. Abortion is bad. It should never be an option. But it is. Wether the lord likes it or not women are going to make abortions. So they better do it in hospitals where they are being taken care of then in the streets paying big bucks to some crazy guy who kills the baby and the mom sometimes.
It's like drugs. They are bad but they exist. You can't just ignore that fact. You can't just let the drug addicts share their nedles and spread AIDS. You have to give them nedles.
Sentences like this make me really confused:
"But Bush is our leader and Christians are instructed that we are to submit to them"
Even if bush is an idiot you have to submit to what he thinks because the lord tells you too?
It's too much for me to understand. I think there are some really good things we can take from the bible. But there are also things that don't make any sense nowadays. What about free will? Wasn't that given to men by god? We should all be able to think for our own heads and do what we feel it's the right thing. If we met god in the "end" then I'll explain that to him. I'm sure he is a reasonable guy. I'll pay the penalty if I have too but I'm not just going to follow some book without even thinking about it.
PS: Even if we tottaly disagree on this matter I admire you for defending what you believe in. It's much easier for me as this is just common sense from a common person. You stand by what is a question of faith. That takes guts and many that feel like you would keep their mouth shut to avoid being attacked.