|
Post by Boyd on Oct 13, 2005 0:18:01 GMT -4
I'm being serious. I want to know why you don't have them in the top 11 of the West. I think if they are healthy, its a no brainer they're a playoff team. It's probably the other way around. If everyone has their share of big injuries, Memphis will make the playoffs. Top explain why, 1st we all agree that the west is wide open so lots of teams can make it. 2nd I'll assume that we agree that the top 6 are going to finish ahead of the Grizzlies. Then it's simple. It's all about dominant players and dominant coaches. I think an healthy Jazz are a very good team. Sloan is a top 3 coach in the NBA and AK is a dominant player. With AK at the begining of the last season, Jazz were doing great and at top in the standings. Then the Lakers. Well, the Lakers have Phil Jackson who I think will get the Lakers some wins by himself. Then they have Kobe and Kobe, well, we can hate him but he is a top 5 player in the NBA and we all know those bring the wins in close games. So as you can see, when things are close, I bet on the best of the best, and Grizzlies although a nice team, don't have those and that will hurt them down the line. Stoud and Eddie Jones make them a better team? Not really imo. Can anyone on the Grizzlies explode for a career season? You probably think Mike Miller will turn into a stud and help Gasol but I don't see that much upside in anyone. I am a huge Jwill fan, but having Damon Stoudemire and Bobby Jackson is a HUGE upgrade over Jwill and Earl. Eddie Jones is an upgrade over Bonzi. I was also a huge fan of Bonzi when he was here, but he was a headcase. Eddie can still score the ball, and is a premier defender in the league...but most important he is a good guy and a great team player. Shane and Mike are back. Mike had his breakout year last year really when he shot the hell outta the ball. He is going to get more open shots this year with Eddie, and Pau there. Pau is Pau. We lost Stro, Bonzi, Jwill, Posey, and Earl. All of them were either headcases, always hurt, or just plain blew ass (Earl Watson). I'm not saying we're gonna be the 4th seed this year, but we are an improved team from last year. Better then the Jazz hands down.
|
|
|
Post by sativa417 on Oct 13, 2005 0:18:40 GMT -4
yeah, that's interesting. We made the playoffs last year with numerous injuries, a coach change, and major inner turmoil. I'd be surprised if we didn't have the best year in Grizz history. We got rid of every bad influence and replaced them with proven vets. I know it's just your opinion, so i'm not bashing it or anything, just giving my opinion. I think Grizz will land the 5/6 seed.
|
|
|
Post by sativa417 on Oct 13, 2005 0:22:46 GMT -4
the only reason I place us that high is because of the depth. Every team is going to have injuries and most likely struggle, but our depth allows us to overcome most any injury as seen the last two years
|
|
|
Post by Dan on Oct 13, 2005 0:23:24 GMT -4
I think the Grizzlies might or might not make the playoffs.
|
|
|
Post by sativa417 on Oct 13, 2005 0:24:19 GMT -4
there's a 50% chance that i might possibly agree
|
|
|
Post by Jogo on Oct 13, 2005 0:40:15 GMT -4
Yes Nate, it's all true but what about the Jazz and the Lakers?
Jazz lost AK for almost the season and Boozer for a considerable part of it. They have a coach that might be the best when it comes to team play and a lesson learned Okur. Also Deron who I really don't know about but I'll consider a top 5 pick an upgrade from Keith McLeod. So we can't really say that the Grizzlies had more problems than the Jazz last season.
Then the Lakers. They had the same inner turmoil, coach change etc but they had bigger problems when it comes to injuries. Dispite all that they we in the playoff hunt and just when Kobe and Odom went down they started losing like 20 in row.
Don't get me wrong, I really like the Grizzlies and I think Gasol is the kind of player that can make guys better and help carry the team for 3 quarters, but when we look at a team, we can't just look at the team. There's also the competition. And the competition had worse problems last season and have better coachs imo. I believe the Grizzlies problem will be the same old. They don't have the steady go to guy that will finish the games for them. That shows usually more in the postseason but with every team healthy that also be important in the regular season.
And to end, I don't think there are many teams in the league that can survive injuries as well the Grizzlies. So when we talk about injuries all around, the Grizzlies come out on top.
As for what you said Jason. Yes some guys were head cases. Eddie Jones isn't and although Bonzi can be more dominant he has to many ups and downs and Jones is more steady so yes, that can be an upgrade. As for Stoud, if J Will had his problems he could also be brilliant and Stoud isn't exactly the model player. It's one of those players who you need to question his heart. He could if he wanted to, but does he want to?
Also, Mike Miller had his breakout year scoring 13.5 pgg in 30 minutes? Can't exactly depend much on him.
|
|
|
Post by Jogo on Oct 13, 2005 0:47:59 GMT -4
Oh and if the Grizzlies end up ahead of the Lakers and Jazz I wouldn't call it a suprise. It can happen. Just like the Clippers can make the playoffs, or the Wolves, or the Sonics, or the Warriors (who I think are really really close this season) but when I looked at it, the little things made the difference. Also it's based on no team getting seriously hurt by injuries although we know they always strike someone.
Might even be the Suns that go from 1st seed to out of the playoffs.
I just didn't put the Warriors and Clippers there because they have a tradition of sucking.
|
|
|
Post by sativa417 on Oct 13, 2005 0:49:41 GMT -4
yes, jazz and lakers had their problems, but I think we're still a better team than both. Jazz are relying on a rookie PG, who even if he has a solid year will likely struggle. Boozer and AK should have great years and Sloan is an elite coach, but I think we'll beat them out this year. Lakers should have a better year with Phil and their new additions, but McKie is an average PG and Kwame has yet to prove he can be consistent the whole year. Odom and Kobe is their team, unless the others step up. Grizz don't have any superstars, but we have several players that can score and don't rely on one or two players to win us the game, so even if Gasol has an off night we have other players that can pick up the slack. It's all a matter of opinion, of course.
|
|
|
Post by Boyd on Oct 13, 2005 0:56:15 GMT -4
Also, Mike Miller had his breakout year scoring 13.5 pgg in 30 minutes? Can't exactly depend much on him. When I said Mike had his breakout year, I was talking about how he shot the ball. 50% from the field for a SG is nice.
|
|
|
Post by sativa417 on Oct 13, 2005 1:06:11 GMT -4
Miller didn't start to hit his stride until the second half. Hopefully that translates over to this year, but like always, Miller has injury problems
|
|
|
Post by Jogo on Oct 13, 2005 1:07:15 GMT -4
You are right about the Lakers and about the Grizzlies. They are totally different teams. One is a team, the other is 1 plus 1 plus the rest. And no matter how much I dislike Kobe, I put them above because of him. I've seen Kobe win games by himself. And although he can't win a championship, I bet he will come out hungry this season and win lots of games just by himself. When I add Phil to that, I put them making the playoffs.
This is a good argument and could last all night long but it the end I think it all comes down to, what is more important? A really good team or a decent team with great players? I've put the decent team with great players ahead because of past expirience. The Jazz of 2 years ago were a great example. No team knew more about team play than the Jazz. It was a joy to watch them. Their movements, their sharing of the ball, they really played basketball but they had no star. They had a great season but still finished 9th...
Don't know if you saw the movie but it's just like in coach Carter. Carter had a good team with great spirit. When the tournament round or whatever is called came, they played a team that were less together but they had the new LeBron. They won...
|
|
|
Post by Jogo on Oct 13, 2005 1:10:09 GMT -4
Also, Mike Miller had his breakout year scoring 13.5 pgg in 30 minutes? Can't exactly depend much on him. When I said Mike had his breakout year, I was talking about how he shot the ball. 50% from the field for a SG is nice. 50.5 FG 43.3 from 3pt. Great team player. Good to have but he isn't that great creating his own shot although his handling is pretty good. He needs that something extra for the team to be able to depend on him. Maybe it's this season.
|
|
|
Post by Seattle Slough on Oct 13, 2005 1:42:50 GMT -4
Explain how the team in the playoffs that gave the spurs the hardest time, was an injured seattle team. No Vlad Rad, Lewis was out a couple of games, allen played injured. We came the closest to beating the NBA champs, but you still think they can't compete.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2005 2:06:45 GMT -4
actually the pistons came closest fuchis.
The wolves and jazz don't stand a chance.
The lakers could get in, but as of right now I'd have them as the 9th seed in the west
|
|
|
Post by "Three Time" on Oct 13, 2005 2:41:37 GMT -4
jogo with regards to how you few the grizz and several other teams with decent teams and great players. i dont really want to get into all this becasue i dont feel like arguing bout it. ill simply give you my thought on this situation and its simple. these decent teams that you speak of with great playes win games. teams that play together as a unit compete every night, therefore they win over the long haul. yes the kobe's of the world will win his share of games by himself , but teams that play together win night in night out esp. during the middle of the season when things get kind of slow. the wolves play the clippers on game 40 say and kg is tired cause its a back to back and he went for 45 and pulled out the win but tonight he just doesnt have it and clippers blow em out. things like this happen all the time during the middle of the season. one guy just cant carry an entire team over 82 games. those damn grizz just win those meaningless games in dec. jan. feb. and wind up in the playoffs. ah now playoffs does the team thing work here? somewhaat but those dominate players are all of a sudden focused and dominate and are able to lead their teams to 4 out of 7. what makes it perfect is a guy like duncan who can dominate in a team setting on both ends of the floor. just my thougts but not to hard to understand. this is not just a grizz thing but an entire nba thing. just ask lebron last year
|
|